by Richard Shin

Lord willing, you will be the head of LBCSD. Let’s imagine Pastor John won’t read this. What would you like to do differently?

I would like to preach through the Book of John and preach it slowly. Haha… I know John really wants to finish the Book of John. I’m actually surprised that he has kept up the pace and gone through this far. I didn’t think he would be able to do it. There’s so much to preach in the Book of John. And I know it’s torturing him; there’s so much in the Book of John. But I think it will be a good thing for us, Lord willing, to go through the book.

What would I do differently? Hm…I mean, in seminary, they always warn you if you ever take over another ministry to be careful of changing everything. Like I said, people don’t like change. And sometimes it comes across as “I know better.” And I know that’s not the case.

But I think to a certain degree, change will be necessary just given the people that we’re losing and all of that. I’m sure people will step up and fill in the gaps too.

What would I change…? I’ve joked around about losing the tie on Sundays. But that might be my youthfulness coming out.

Let’s say you stepped into the building of Lighthouse one Sunday morning in ten years. What would you like to see happen?

Sure. I’m going to steal this one from Pastor MacArthur because he just celebrated forty years. I don’t know if this is true because I don’t go to Grace. But MacArthur said that the series that he gave during his first year at Grace Church was the series he gave in his 40th year. Meaning that the principles that he committed to at the outset never changed, they never turned to the left or the right, they kept right down the road in terms of what they were committed to. They wanted a high view of God, they wanted a high view of His Word. Everything that became the pillars for the church that are built on Biblical principles, they’ve committed to over that long a span of time. And that’s remarkable for a church. Given all the fads and trends that have come and gone, to not have gone the course of those things. There is a lot of temptation to do that. If every church looks a certain way, and you don’t, it doesn’t look good for you. And I think that’s one thing I’ve really come to appreciate at Grace Church. It’s that unwavering commitment to Biblical doctrine.

I would love to do that same thing. And that’s something I planned on doing as soon as the church plant leaves, to teach a series on “What are the foundations of Lighthouse? What are things that are non-negotiable? What are the things that we really want to build this ministry on?” I would love to do that series again in ten years, and we haven’t turned to the right or the left. That would be sweet. That would be great.

If you were to ever plant a church yourself. Where would you like to go?

San Jose. Haha, I’m just kidding. I would say the only place in the world that has particularly drawn us that we’ve seen a great need, and along with that, a heart to be there, was Argentina. There’s already a strong church with whom we work with and to partner with in our work out there, but one thing that’s been of concern is the lack of theological training that is available there. And to have been seminary-trained, and to be able to go out there and help other pastors would be just an amazing work. There’s a tremendous need. If the Lord would work it out that we could do that someday, that would be awesome. While right now, I think it would be helpful and better if I had some years of ministry under my belt. Some of these pastors have been serving there for years, and here I am coming up on year one on being senior pastor… I don’t think I’ll have a lot to say. To be able to relate to them, it’ll be hard.

Also, related to that, I’ve always been taught that a pastor should anchor himself to a ministry. So many pastors… I think the average is that pastors tend to stick around three years or something like that before they move on. And a lot of pastors treat ministry as a stepping stone to greater things. And that’s never been my desire. I’ve told people this too, Christine and I are not making plans to leave any time soon. We would like to anchor ourselves here and be here for a significant time. I think that’s important for the members to see that. And I think it’s helpful for the church as a whole. And this won’t be like a three years and out of kind of thing… unless I die or Jesus comes back. Hallelujah!

What’s something people don’t know about you?

Um…I’m exceptionally charming?

You mean, people don’t know that about you?! Hm. Let me rephrase. What are some things people don’t know about you that might help us understand you better in terms of your ministry?

Haha! Here’s one. I feel like people already… you get what you see. I talk a lot more than I probably should. And because of that, I think I expose everything inside. I’m a lot more comfortable in front of people than I am one-on-one or in small groups or things like that. Not to say I’m not willing to do all that. Obviously it comes with the territory, and that’s something I need to do. If I had a choice between leading a small group, and teaching a Sunday school class, I would teach Sunday school class ten out of ten.

I mean, I enjoy the one-on-one and small group times, but when I am teaching or giving a message, I really get that sense that this is what I’m supposed to do. And I think that’s why when I preach, I smile so often. I really, really enjoy preaching. It’s one of my favorite things to do. I love talking about God, I love talking about His Word, I love seeing people’s eyes widen when they hear something they’ve never heard before or when they learn something new, I love the feedback I get when people tell me they’ve learned something that day, they’re growing or they got saved. It’s what keeps me going. I really enjoy teaching. I don’t know… maybe people already knew that.

How can we as a congregation encourage you in the upcoming year? And how can we pray for you?

I don’t know…keep doing what you’re doing? Christine and I have been so blessed. What church sends their pastor to Cabo for a week? The generosity of the church has been so amazing. And it’s not just this year; it’s been like that since day one. The church has been amazingly supportive. It really is the best scenario that we can possibly be in.

One thing I might throw in, but in comparison to the support we’ve already received, this is a minor thing. I would caution the members about expectations. Expectations destroy relationships, especially unfair expectations. Christine and I know I’m not John Kim and she’s not Angela Kim. Those are tremendous shoes to fill. One thing I’m thankful for is God led them to this point too. They didn’t always have the insight that they have now; they started at a certain point too. And it is going to take a little bit of patience. We have a very seasoned pastor in Pastor John, a very experienced pastor, just a brilliant communicator. He’s a really good pastor! And I think a lot of people might be here just for John. And that is the inevitable thing: when John leaves, I’m not John. I’ve been trained by him, but I’m not him. We’re going to have different styles, different weaknesses and strengths. Some people might enjoy the changes, and for others it might take some getting used to.

Beware of those expectations. It’s like that in any relationship. In marriage, if you have unfair expectations for your spouse, it’s going to be a disappointing relationship, but if you understand that anything you get out of it is grace, then it makes the relationship so much more meaningful.

Any last words?

One thing I would like to see in the upcoming months is for the church to rally together, and really stand behind this church plant. I couldn’t think of any other way to encourage John and the church plant more than for the home church to be completely onboard, excited and supportive. And I think a lot of it will come down to the way we present it, to help people remember that this is an offshoot of our Biblical way of ministry. We’re not doing it for the sake of doing it; we’re doing it because we’re committed to certain principles Scripturally. If you’re passionate about Scripture, there’s no reason you shouldn’t be passionate about this plant. It’s doing God’s work God’s way. People might question the timing of it, the wisdom of it, or whatever. To that, I would just say, when is it ever going to be convenient? I’m so thankful for the team that’s going. Pastor John recently asked us as leadership, why do you support this church plant? And my answer was, “Because I can’t go.” God has made it clear that He wants me to say. And I’ll stay and be as supportive of this church plant as I possibly can be. And I hope that’s the same with other people, that if God has made it clear that they should stay, that they should be as supportive as they possibly can be. That would be sweet to see. It’s like when we first announced it. When we first announced it, we had this great ovation. And I was thinking to myself, “I know we’re excited now, but let’s see if that excitement carries on to the very end.” Because it’s going to have its difficulties.

by Richard Shin

Pastor Patrick graciously allowed me to invite myself over to his place. As we sat in his living room, he talked very honestly about his thoughts on his ordination, the mutual love between him and the church, and his future role as Senior Pastor of Lighthouse Bible Church. The text does not do justice to the amount of personality he showed during the interview. I hope that, as you read it, you would imagine Pastor Patrick saying these things. And through it all, I really hope you will come to understand him more as he assumes a greater responsibility in the coming months. At the same time, I hope you also come to understand that we worship the much gracious and loving God who grants him that responsibility.

Can you tell us who you are, and what your role is?

My name is Patrick Cho. I am currently an Associate Pastor at Lighthouse Bible Church, but this summer when the San Jose church plant team leaves with Pastor John, I will be stepping in as Senior Pastor.

How do you feel? Are you scared?

People ask me this a lot. My response is almost always the same. I don’t think “scared” is the best word. I’m not scared because obviously I know God is in control. And actually given the situation, it actually breeds a lot more confidence. The church was planted ten years ago, and we’re still here. And just to have seen God’s faithfulness in the past ten years, it makes you wonder, “Is He just going to abandon us now? Did He bring us this far just to leave us?” No. It’s hard for me to accept that. As God has walked with us, we trust that He will continue to walk with us. I’m not saying it’s going to be easy; I’m sure it’s going to be challenging. I’m sure I don’t even know half of what I’ll experience, even in the near future. But I’m not scared. No. I think more than anything, I just recognize that I need to be dependent. And I think that’s one very important perspective.

What are some fears you have to trust God with?

Well, there are all sorts of unknowns. For instance, when the church plant leaves, what if the San Diego church dwindles down to like ten people? You can’t really get caught up with the what-ifs because all sorts of stuff could happen. A storm could come through, and a tree could fall on our church building. Or I die (chuckle). All sorts of different things could happen. Again, I just look at the pattern of ministry that we’ve had the past ten years. Even though there’s a good group of people leaving for San Jose, the majority of the church is still staying. And I think the spiritual atmosphere has been pretty consistent over the years. We’ve had a lot of members who just love the Lord and want to grow in His Word and want to serve and help. Personally, I think we have one of the most generous congregations in the world. Because of that, I don’t get too worried about all the crazy what-ifs. Like I said, I’m just confident that God has led us this far, and He will continue to lead us. Personally I’m a firm believer that God stands for those who stand for Him. Deciding to go plant the church in San Jose is not the “easier” road. We’re taking the more difficult road. Because of that, I think God will bless it.

Throughout the ordination process, and just your overall ministry at church, you and your family had to go through a lot, I’m sure. What has been a significant concern or challenge so far? And significant blessing, if different?

Over the past ten years, John and I have spent so much time together. It really has come to the point where I can finish his sentences. And we have a good sense of how we feel and what we’re going through and what’s bothering us; we have a good read for each other. I’ve just been so thankful for all the training I’ve received on the way. I think one of the things that Christine and I talked about is that once John leaves for the church plant, Angela’s going to be leaving too. That’s been something we’ve been wondering what it’ll be like. She does so much to help the ladies of the church. Christine and Ange, although they do spend a lot of time together, it’s nowhere near the time John and I spend together. And I think that will be challenging. For both of us, we’ll have big shoes to fill. One thing I’m thankful for is that it’s not our job to live up to them. Our job is to do our best with what God has given us and how God has gifted us. I’m not John Kim and Christine’s not Angela Kim. And hopefully we won’t be expected to be. I’m sure in some ways when John leaves, certain things will change. We’re different people with different styles and different focuses, different drives, different passions. It’s not going to be the “same as always”.

To answer that question, some things are going to change and people typically don’t like change. That’s why we’ve been warning the church to brace itself. It’s going to be a changing year. There’s going to be a lot of change coming this year. That’s what happens when thirty people up and leave with two-thirds of the pastoral staff. That’s just the way it’s going to be.

One blessing is, while I always knew ordination was kind of there, and I always knew at some point I would have to go through it, but I was hoping to go through life being able to avoid it. Maybe Jesus would come back or something. It’s kind of like graduating seminary. When I graduated seminary, I thought, “Wow, how did I just do that?” That’s crazy. What an accomplishment, not for myself, but to see God lead me through that. I remember feeling so much joy. He didn’t have to, you know? He didn’t need me. And to have graduated with a bit of success too is really reassuring for me. And the same thing with ordination; I told John, I don’t want to just pass. If I’m going to study for it, I’m going to do well. It actually puts a little bit more pressure on me. I don’t want to just get by. I want to put my best effort into it. When it was all over, I just remember thinking, “Wow, He did it again!” God helped me through it again. I mean… I really have no reason to doubt. I have no reason to think God’s going to just leave us. He’s just been so amazingly faithful and gracious to us. It’s been great.

What doctrine or particular passage from the Bible has been encouraging you the most in your endeavor to be ordained and eventually lead Lighthouse?

Sure, sure… Actually, this one’s kind of easy. I’ve always drawn the analogy of Moses and Joshua and John and myself. Not to say that we’re of that spiritual caliber, but the circumstances are very similar. Kind of like what I shared during the ordination service. Both are of significant change, a transition of leadership, tremendous responsibility. There are a lot of parallels between the two. And if you look at Joshua and his character, he had sometimes an imbalanced sense of loyalty for Moses, and sometimes I think just the fact that I’m young, that comes across too. I’ll speak before I should, and I’ll come to John’s defense, like “how dare anyone say anything bad about John?” kind of thing. I see a lot of that parallel just to see how Moses trained up Joshua and trusted him with leadership and all of that.

And a significant chapter is Joshua 1 where the Lord tells Joshua, (paraphrasing) “be strong and courageous as I have been with my servant Moses, so I’ll be with you.” John has been such a big source of comfort to me. John and I serve the same God who shows the same faithfulness, who provided for John all these years for all that he went through. The same God that carried Him through all of that is the same God who keeps me. And I told him that there will probably be times when I’m very tempted to call him and get all the answers from him. But there’s a side of me that wants to just trust and wait and see how God will teach me through particular circumstances too, in the same way that He taught John. And who knows? Maybe He will teach me some completely different lessons through very similar circumstances. But I’m excited to see what that will be. I’m glad to have a lifeline; I really am. I’m sure I’ll make use of it. It probably won’t be the case where I’m calling him every day asking, “What do I do now? What do I do now? What do I do now?” There’s a sense where I just need to trust in God who leads me, the same Spirit indwells us, and the same Christ saved us. It’s just amazing to think it really does help build a lot of confidence. That’s why I said, I’m not scared. Even though it is a formidable task, I’m not scared.

What is the most valuable lesson you’ve learned serving under Pastor John (whether it be through his actions or his speech)?

Yea… In a word, it’s “ministry.” I’ve said this often, and that’s that John has taught me everything I know about ministry. I mean, seminary taught me a lot of principles and theology, but John helped me bridge theology to life. And not only has he taught me that, he has shown me. Just having seen him go through the trials that he has gone through, just seeing him lead his family, just seeing how he’s committed to the church. There are days when he comes before I do, and he stays way later than anybody else. Just the self-sacrifice he puts into the ministry is a huge example for me. So often I would go to our pastoral staff meeting, and they would ask, “how has your week been?” and I would say, “Man, it was tough.” And then he’ll come over the top and I’ll think, “Man, I have no reason to complain. My life is easy in comparison.”

I’ve really appreciated John’s scope and lens, his listening ear. He still treats you like you’re the most important person. He just has this way… that is one huge lesson I’ve learned from him: how to relate to people. That is his strength; that is his forte. Relating to people, helping them, and challenging them to live according to Biblical standards, according to Biblical principles. For me, I love teaching the Word. While I do consider myself a people person, I just don’t have that wealth of experience that John has, counseling people and all of that. I’ve learned so much along the way.

There would be times I would sit through counseling sessions, and I’m thinking, “He’s going to tear this person apart!” And then he’s totally gracious. And there are other times I think he’s going to say one thing, and then he goes a completely different direction. I mean, he’s not perfect. But I would say as often as I’ve seen him, the direction he has steered counseling sessions have been the wise directions. Where I might react too quickly with anger, he has shown patience and forbearance. And where I might have shown too much leniency in certain cases, he has been direct. And I’ve been really thankful having seen that over the years. I don’t have all the discernment yet to be able to distinguish between the two [situations], but he has really taught me many of the signs to look for, just really helped me in terms of what passages to turn to… oh, there’s so much more…

What would you like to see LBCSD work on? What practical steps do you want us to take as a body?

It’s kind of the same as it has been: a commitment to the MVP and a commitment to the Peacemaker Pledge. I think so long as we’re committed to that, we’ll be okay. It has been that way since day one. If anything were to be a significant threat to the church, it’s going to be the members’ unwillingness to resolve things in a God-glorifying way.

I would like to see a greater commitment to that one-body principle. I would love to see at church on Sunday where no one feels left out, where no one feels like an outsider. And that’s something that everybody needs to work on. It means not gravitating towards people you’re comfortable with. It’s reaching out and (God-forbid!) talking to new visitors. Not leaving it for the New Visitor Team to do it. It’s something I’ve told the college group too, “You all are the New Visitor Team”. We actually have a team to help facilitate things, but the entire group is the NVT. And all of us need to be making an effort to continue to do that.

And I’m not saying that we don’t. Honestly, I’m really happy with the way things have gone the past ten years. We have a wonderful congregation. And the testimony of those who have come supports that. I’m not just trying to toot our horn or whatever, but people have come and said, “This is one of the most welcoming churches I’ve been to. This is the most loving church I’ve been to.” And that’s funny because we’re so often tagged with being so committed to truth that we don’t love. And I would really challenge anyone who has that opinion to come and visit, and spend a day with our members and tell me we don’t love. Our members are loving. But I think it could be an excel-still-more kind of thing. It’s one of those things that you could always do more. And in ten years from now, if we were still doing that, how awesome would that be.

A thing I would like to see more of at our church is a deliberate outreach mentality. Again, I don’t think we don’t have that. But again, it’s one of those excel-still-more kinds of things where we could do better.

But, you know, it’s all ideal. It would be great to send out a missions team and every member from the greatest to the least of them are on board. And when we come back, and we do our missions report night, every member is there because they felt like they were part of the team. They weren’t just giving a donation, but they were actually part of the sending team, and they’re passionate about what they’re supporting. I’m not sure we’re quite there yet. I think that’s the case for some people, but I’m not sure it’s the case from the greatest to the least of them.

And lastly, we still have a number of members who aren’t doing much. There are members, but they’re kind of the “invisible” members. They’re not serving in any ministry; they’re not serving in any capacity. And I would like to help challenge those members be part of the body, help us function together, help us grow together, as it says in Ephesians 2 to “grow into the holy temple of the Lord.” That would be good. There aren’t a lot of them though. And that’s the thing I’ve been really thankful for, the members at our church. I have only reason to be thankful. I think many pastors would be very envious of our church in San Diego. Not to say we have the perfect church, but we have a lot of reasons to be thankful.

(to be concluded next week with part 2)

by Richard Shin

What is the greatest legacy you would like to leave behind as you depart from San Diego?

I hope that people would have known that I genuinely loved God and loved people; I know I don’t do it perfectly. That I’ve tried to be a sincere gentleman in fulfilling my role as a pastor. And I hope that people would have been challenged to look beyond the status quo. That they be willing to trust God, and that they be willing to have God be front and center of their lives, to the point where they submit family life to that, and church life and school and job, everything. I think Matthew 16:24 is probably a verse that has impressed upon my heart in junior high. And it says if anyone is to come after me, deny himself, pick up his cross, and follow after me. It’s just very clear, that my life now is no longer for myself, but to follow Christ, and that everything in life would revolve around that.

I hope people know that I enjoyed life too. I liked to have fun, but not fun for fun’s sake, but really to celebrate people and their lives. I hope people would know I have genuinely cared for people. I’ve been willing to be part of people’s lives in whatever ways God would have me.

I think I’ve made more than my share of mistakes. I hope people would be forgiving toward that, as well as all the long, long sermons. That’s one thing people will probably remember me for, more than anything. I hope it’s not just the length of the sermon, but it’s the heart and principle of the sermon that would be left behind.

What will you miss most about LBCSD? And San Diego in general?

Well, the people for sure. I really love our church family. We’ve developed such precious friendships with many people. Those are things you just can’t trade. I will miss those especially who have ministered to our family. I know our kids will miss all the other kids, especially all their cousins. Yeah… definitely the people. There are other things I can live without, even things like Mexican food and stuff like that. But the people really… having seen the church grow, and coming into this office, and having all the books there, those are all things I’m really thankful for, but more than anything, it’s the people that I would miss the most. I’m already sad thinking that I’ll miss out on seeing the kids growing up. I love watching all the kids. I love playing with them and making faces at them. I’m kind of sad because none of them will probably remember me, but I’m sure I’ll have the chance to visit time to time, and I’m sure people will visit. But it won’t be the same. That’s something I learned when you move to a different place. Things just aren’t the same. I’ll definitely miss a lot of the people. But I hope to carry on the friendships to the future too.

Let’s say you stepped into the building of LBCSD ten years from now, what would you like to see?

Oh, boy… I would like to see everyone here ten years older. But ten years even more mature in their faith. I would like to see the families providing the backbone of the church in terms of leadership and just spreading themselves among the congregation from anywhere between preschool to youth to college. That’s one thing I really appreciated about growing up at Grace Church, all the parents after their kids have grown up, that they would really get involved in the life of the church. I know at this stage, it’s hard but maybe ten years from now when the kids have grown up, and parents are a little more flexible in terms of what they can do, and I hope they’ll really maximize their investments in people. I really hope to see Titus 2 really fulfilled where the older men and women are really teaching the younger men and women and discipling them, mentoring them. I hope the church would just continue to grow, and do things for the community and the world in terms of missions. Maybe we would even partner in those things along the way in some degree.

I hope in ten years the church would have still remained faithful to the MVP. Hopefully that’s not going to change. Hopefully with all the challenges and tests and trials that have come, that the Peacemaker’s Pledge would have been upheld. Hopefully those things that we see as the pillars of the church, they would stand true. Hopefully in ten years, we would be able to come back and see that we planted more churches.

What would be one last thought, morsel of truth, or wisdom that you would like to leave LBC with?

Oh, wow… Trying to think of one… I would say be patient with people. Everyone’s in the process of growing and learning. We can’t compare one person’s growth to another. Some people grow at a quicker rate than others, who might take a longer time. Just to be patient, really applying 1 Corinthians 13. Love is patient, love is kind… when we studied that earlier last year with the singles, I think that was something that was really pressed upon my heart, that I like to think I’m patient and kind, but when I realize how easy it is to be impatient and unkind towards people, even people that are close to me. Just be patient because God is the one who’s molding people, and teaching people. Remember that the Holy Spirit is the one who is changing people’s hearts; we can’t manipulate people’s hearts to change. We’re not the Holy Spirit’s Assistant. We don’t have the ability to just do that, but we have opportunity to love people, and teach them and we can’t force change. Just really be patient with people, and love people like Christ loved us. Be faithful to God’s Word. And I think that’s what people have always known that that’s something we’ve always stood for, and I won’t take that for granted because the church has changed over time. Sometimes people lose sight of what our original foundations were about, but that’s why I’m glad Pastor Patrick will be here and the elders will be here. Hopefully those foundations will be strengthened and continually reaffirmed. Hopefully people will not lose sight of holding fast to the truth, even when it becomes unpopular.

What do you see yourself doing in ten years? In twenty years?

Well, hopefully I’ll still be alive. Hopefully I’ll still be walking. I do hope to see us planting more churches; I don’t know what my role will be for that. I think part of me thinks maybe that my role could become more a resource-sort of role, to help raise and support and train up guys who would lead the church plants and provide support. So maybe within ten or twenty years, that’s what my role could be. In some regard, still having a home base somewhere, but maybe I can do something like that. Ten to twenty years, hopefully all my girls will be married and have kids, and Angela and I can be grandparents and have fun with them. But I don’t think Angela and I will ever just sit around and get lazy doing nothing. I think we’ll always want to be doing ministry. So when all the kids are out of the house, maybe that’ll be our time to do missions work abroad. So maybe she and I can be committed to encouraging and supporting and helping some of the churches we’re working with now in Argentina and Czech Republic. Who knows?

How can we as a congregation encourage you? And how can we pray for you?

I think the best way to encourage me would be to keep growing, and to really keep teachable in terms of learning God’s truth, to be really available to be useful for God’s kingdom. I think when Paul says the greatest joy is when he saw the churches growing. You can pray for me to not lose sight of the big picture. Not to get frustrated with details, maybe not working out the way I anticipate, but trusting God with those things. One thing for sure is to pray for our family; it’s possibly Jenna’s last year with us as a family as she thinks about college. That’s one thing I resolved this year to do, just spend more time with Angela and the girls, in spite of all the changes ahead of us, and not to use that as an excuse. Pray for me to stay positive and be encouraging to others. I tend to dwell on problems, and sometimes I can get negative-minded just dealing with all the problems. I just want to be focusing on being thankful and just encouraging people. Other than that, it would be encouraging to hear from people how they’re learning, and how they’re growing. I don’t know, so don’t assume I know.

to be continued next week with Pastor Patrick…

by Richard Shin

Pastor John and I met within the confines of his office. As someone who hears him preach on a semi-weekly basis, and given his openness during his messages, I thought I had him figured out for the most part. But after having gone through this interview with him, I realized there is much more to Pastor John Kim than what he reveals on the pulpit. I hope this interview will motivate you to talk to him, get to know him, and squeeze every bit of wisdom from the man as you possibly can before he leaves. Within reason, of course.

What is your role in the San Jose church plant?

My role for the San Jose church plant is to be the senior pastor and pretty much the point person to help provide leadership and direction and hopefully encourage everybody and shepherd everybody along the way as we get going.

What has been a significant challenge or concern so far? And a significant blessing, if different?

Probably one of the more significant challenges that seem to affect people is the practical considerations. Trying to relocate, find a new job, sell your home… all those things in this economy especially is raising concerns among parents, questioning, is this the right time? Understandably, there’s a lot of difficulty having to handle the practical side of things. So, I know the people have been wrestling with that, having just the reality of making a major move. That too has been difficult for a lot of people, even for us, having to sell our home, and to anticipate uprooting our family. On the practical end, that has probably been a significant challenge.

At the same time, it’s a blessing. We’re seeing that people are willing to live out Matthew 6:33: “seek first His kingdom and His righteousness”. To really see the point of planting a church to be actually something that would guide one’s life direction as opposed to work or school. I think a lot of people don’t realize how much they let the worldly elements of life to dictate their life, not to say that it’s all evil and bad, but sometimes people don’t realize how much they need God to accommodate their agenda as opposed to saying we need to follow God’s agenda, and orient everything around that, whether it be school, work or even buying a home.

I think that’s what’s been most encouraging to see, the commitment of the people who have been willing to act on that, especially the younger group of people. Some of them have never been to San Jose; for them it’s a huge step of faith. Initially I think I was a little disappointed because I thought maybe more of the older members might be considering going. Understandably, it’s difficult when you’ve got a young family, and you still got young kids. I think I’ve come to understand that God has to be the one who moves people’s hearts to go and God is also going to be responsible for people staying. He has a purpose in it all. So I think I’m okay with that now.

That played into something too. I thought, “Is our team young?” It would be helpful to have mature, older, more experienced people and I think that is definitely something that is important. But I think on the other end, having younger people also bring a lot of enthusiasm and a lot of energy. And I think because they’re willing to take some risks too, it does definitely lend itself toward giving a very positive outlook for what we hope to see happen.

What are you looking forward to for the church plant?

I’m looking forward to just being able to spend time with people a lot more again. As our church got bigger here, my role had to adjust because the dynamics aren’t the same. I’m not complaining about that or anything; I’m very grateful that our church has grown. But I think I particularly enjoy interacting with people a lot more. I’m looking forward to just developing things from the beginning again. And some people think that’s the hard part of it. But I think it’s the more enjoyable part, being able to interact with the majority of the group and getting to know everyone on a first name basis and actually remembering who they are. And just to be more involved in their lives on a more personal level. I miss that. That aspect, as the church gets bigger, it’s just impossible to maintain that kind of relationship with everybody. So the developmental stage I think I really enjoy.

I’m also looking forward to getting to know people in the community. Being evangelistic, hoping to just let everyone who comes know that they are welcome and that we would love to get to know them, and hopefully seeing people come to know Christ. Having that be a more distinguishing mark than just transfer growth.

What are some fears you need to trust God with both for LBCSD and LBCSJ?

For San Jose, there are just practical concerns like, “Will we have money?”, “Will we have resources?”, and “Will we have a place to meet?” I think a lot of basic things because we don’t know what to expect. Will we be able to build a relationship with the church community at large? That’s a very important thing, that we’re not just there to do our own thing, but to partner and build relationships. That’s something I wish we could have seen happen more here.

Another fear is the realities of church. Conflicts, disappointments…that’s just a part of life. That’s something you don’t look forward to. I think especially when it involves people you become close with. The relational side is what carries the most weight for me both in terms of what I look forward to and what do I fear. Like betrayal. That’s already happened several times; it’s something painful to go through. While I hope those things don’t happen, unfortunately they do. But we know God is in control even in those things to shape the church and to help us trust Him more.

On the San Diego side, there’s going to be a lot of transition and adjustment. I’m concerned most for how people will treat Pastor Patrick. I hope they would be respectful and that they would not look down on the fact that he’s younger, but I hope that they can see the pattern of his faithfulness already since the church has started. And that they wouldn’t do any comparing. I think in a lot of ways Pastor Patrick has a lot of gifts and talents that I don’t. He has a lot to offer, and I think he’s shown his faithfulness to the church. I hope people will look at that as opposed to age or experience. Those things are just not fair to compare with someone who has been doing it for like twenty years.

And then for people to not place their hopes on people. The church doesn’t depend on me and so my leaving shouldn’t dictate how the church does. I know there will be practical facts because of relationships and all, but I hope people can just trust God and do their part in filling the gaps and whatever void they think might have been created. Not only with my family leaving, but others leaving. I hope it will lead to people stepping up, instead of people just complaining or moaning and groaning why things are the way they are. Hopefully people will not resort to being negative about all the change. It’ll be hard; it’ll be a challenging. Hopefully it’ll cause people to trust God more, and hopefully they’ll step up.

How do you feel about leaving Pastor Patrick? And how do you feel about taking JR?

I think we shared this at members meeting and at the ordination service. There’s no one else I would trust than Pastor Patrick. He has shown himself to be the most loyal and faithful partner in ministry that I’ve ever had. And that hasn’t come easy. I know he has had to put up with a lot with all my idiosyncrasies and differences, just the way he is. And I’ve been tough on him. And at times, I’ve probably made him cry. But he’s persevered. He’s teachable. He has shown me his willingness to work hard. And his willingness to do anything I’ve asked him to do from pastoral duties to simple things like cleaning up to running missions trips to even stepping in during my leave of absence and to run things and see what it’s like. I’m very confident that he’s going to do a great job. I’m honestly saying that; I’m not just saying that to get people psyched up.

I know Patrick will have his set of struggles, and he’ll have to adjust to being the senior pastor. That just has its own set of challenges that he’ll have to go through. But I hope people would know that he has definitely proven himself over the years. I can honestly say that he has shown himself to be a true friend and partner in ministry and he’s probably the one who has kept me sane over the years because he has made me laugh. Sometimes he would just be silly and help me not be serious about all these things. I’m confident that he’ll do a good job. Hopefully people would be patient with him too, give him room to adjust, and be himself.

Taking JR… I have mixed feelings about it. Personally I’m thankful. At the same time I know it takes a hit for the church because I know he’s been doing such a great job with the youth ministry. And I know the kids love him here. My kids love him too. So we’re fortunate to get him to continue on with us. JR’s heart has been with church plants. When we prayed whether he should be part of the plant or not, honestly I thought he should stay because I thought he could help Patrick. But he told me he fasted and prayed for over a month, and he prayed and trusted that it’s God’s direction for him to go. So, what can I say to that?

I know things don’t always go in the way of conventional thinking. I know that because that’s the way I look at a lot of things myself too. I couldn’t just say that’s not conventionally right or the best thing to do. At the same time I’m definitely thankful that he could come as a ministry partner would be helpful. JR has done a great job pastoring the youth, and not only that, he’s done a great job in developing in his preaching and he’s really grown in his ministry skills and I think it would be good to just have someone who I can count on to be there in case I get sick which happens often or be able to fill in on various ways and for Kathy to come with him. I know it’s going to be a challenge for the church as well to have two of the three pastors leaving.

What are some more encouraging words that you have heard regarding the church plant?

Some of the older folk have come up to me and told me that they are challenged that at this stage of life that we’re willing to do this. I think Angela and I imagined ourselves living in San Diego and just watching the kids grow up and enjoying the nice weather after leaving the east coast where it was cold, appreciating the warm weather more… As God has lain on our hearts to do this, we don’t want to make excuses because of “stage of life” issues. There are those who have been encouraged to not use “stage of life” excuses, and that’s been encouraging to hear.

Others have been encouraging to reaffirm our commitment to church planting. Especially the ones from northern California, they’re thankful that we’re going up there. But I think more than just going up there, they’ve learned a lot and grown here. It’s not just for the sake of having a church, but they want to show what they’ve learned here and have a place where family and friends they can share the gospel with and also bring them out to church. It has been encouraging to see the responses of people looking forward to see what’s going to happen up there.

Even some of the pastors up there have been very encouraging and receptive to partnering, at least developing friendships. When I came to San Diego, it wasn’t like that. No one wanted to be my friend. Churches were not very nice. That’s kind of nice to look forward to, pastors saying, “Yes, we need more churches planted!” In fact one pastor has said he’s willing to offer whatever support he could. When I came to San Diego, there were people actively opposing the church plant. It’s kind of strange. We thought we would encounter opposition from non-Christians, but we encountered more opposition from other Christians. So in San Diego, that was kind of a big difference. So that’s been an encouraging response from people too.

Do you ever have second thoughts? And if so, for what reasons? If not, what thought or conviction helps you stay determined?

I always wonder if I’ve made the right decisions because I don’t know at the time. There’s no 100% guarantee in everything, but I’m just trusting in God. I think one sure thing is trust God, and know that He will work everything out for good. I think I’m learning more and more through the Scriptures that God’s sovereignty really is something we can find comfort in. We can’t forecast or guarantee anything we do in life. Even from a human vantage point, we try to do all our homework and evaluate everything, and maybe make the best decision we think possible, but even then that’s no guarantee that it’s God’s will. I think trusting God is the one thing that keeps me hopeful.

But yeah, sometimes I wonder if we should have sold our house, should we start all over again? Some people say things like, you’re getting older now… why don’t you let the younger guys do it? And sometimes I think, yea, maybe that would be good because I’m tired, my health has not been as good. So sometimes is it the stress of doing these kinds of things that is getting to me more? I think just trying to get re-established all over again for everything, not having relatives close by… that’s the kind of things that come to mind, is this the best thing to do?

But I think about the long term picture, and I ask, what are we living for? We are not living for our own comforts. We’re not living to have our needs met, or have things convenient for us. Are we really considering Matthew 6:33? Is it really our heart’s desire? At a human level, it’s hard. But we trust God’s Word to be true, and that is actually what’s worth living for. And then we strive for that. And we know God will sustain us. But yea, sometimes it’s hard… especially when I think about Mexican food and Evangelical (the bookstore) and my friends there.

Will you be the only on-site elder? And should we be concerned?

Initially in principle, yea. But we already have in place what we call an “Administrative Team”. It’s kind of how we started things here as well, and that we would work together with the team in terms of making decisions. This is not a dictatorship. Yes, I think I need to provide leadership, but at the same time work as a team. There are already certain kinds of things we’re talking through, and having checks and balances for decision-making issues so that it’s not completely just my will being imposed on everybody. At the same time, I would hope that God would use me to provide clear leadership and direction, but not at the expense of just simply imposing my own will. I’ve always been a team guy; I don’t think I’m the guy that’s supposed to make all the calls for everything. But at the same time I’m in a position to teach and equip and challenge people. In good time, our goal would be to appoint elders who would fulfill the qualifications, and we hope to do that very early on in the life of the church.

to be continued…

by Richard Shin

You just got married. You’ll graduate soon. Then you’re going to help plant a church. All this within a year. Are you comfortable with all the changes?

Actually, I won’t be graduating for another year. I’ll be flying up and down every week like some of the Eastbay (now Evangel) guys. That’s something Kathy and I had to think about and pray about. We weren’t sure in the beginning if we wanted to go up after I finished, or fly up and down every week. So we prayed about it individually, and it’s something I had already saved up for, to fly every week. So it wasn’t about the financial aspect. It was about whether she would be on board with me on that. And actually last Saturday, she was like “yep, we should do it.” So I was like “yep, I agree”. Hahaha. So by December I should be done.

In terms of your question, no I’m not comfortable. But then that’s the story of my life, and God has always been faithful through those times. The way that’s been for me is that I’ve always been cautious in terms of getting my feet wet. I’ve never been the guy to be reckless; I’m more the guy who has to be pushed and that’s what Pastor John has been telling me, to take more risks. God’s basically led me that way. I remember my whole plan in seminary has been: be in seminary for four years, be an intern for four years, and then think about going into pastoral ministry. But then all of a sudden I’m 23 and I’m asked to be a youth pastor; I wasn’t ready for that. But God led me that way and I can trust Him. I had never been exposed to the youth before, I had never worked in this ministry, and I had never been in youth group. So that was a big change. But I trusted in God. And He made all these things work out.

Same thing with marriage. I was kind of freaked out before I got married. But just because I’m uncomfortable, who am I to question God? So that’s been kind of my story. I’m back in that familiar place where I’m not comfortable with transitions. But with God leading me that way, I have no reason to not trust Him; I have every reason to trust Him. I’m nervous about what it’s going to be like when I graduate, I don’t know what our life is going to be like up there, what if we have a kid, that’s a possibility, what if something goes wrong with flying and the pregnancy and all that. But as long as I trust in God, I know he’ll work out all things for good for my life.

As a follow-up to the question above, what doctrine/passage from the Bible has encouraged you the most during these times?

Well my life verse at least since a couple years back has been Philippians 3:7-8. That verse has been true in me. I know I’m called to do everything out of my love for Christ it’s not so much about the church plant but it’s more about am I doing what I’m doing because I love God and would I throw everything to gain Him? When that resonates in my heart and whenever I remember that, every decision I make would be a righteous decision. It’s not even about doing things for God, it’s about me wanting to be with God and be close to God. Having that verse has always led me right. It led me to the church plant, and it led me to marrying Kathy.

In terms of a more practical sense, Proverbs 3:5-6 and Proverbs 9:10. I realize can’t trust in myself or my abilities. That’s the thing I always fear, my lack of wisdom but I realize I need to fear the Lord. Not trusting in my own abilities, but trusting in the Lord with all my heart and acknowledging him in everything I do.

Matthew 28:18-20. I just can’t get around that verse. You know, make disciples of all nations. That’s the mission statement of Lighthouse, and that’s the mission statement of my life too. I don’t know… how do you get around that? As authoritative as Christ is, He gets up on that mountain and says go and make disciples of all nations and to teach them to be like Him. You don’t argue with that; you just go.

What will you miss most about LBCSD? About San Diego?

Nothing so much about San Diego…I mean I like the weather here, and as beautiful as San Diego is, I grew up in Hawaii…so SD has always been kind of like second class to me. The beach is nice, but I realized I don’t go there a whole lot any way. Oh, one thing I WILL miss is the zoo! Everyone knows I love animals. I’m going to miss using the zoo pass because that’s been one of the most worshipful experiences for me, going to the zoo and thanking God for His creation. So I’ll miss that for sure.

But really I’ll miss the most is the church, the people. My heart’s always been in the ministry. There’s nothing in San Diego that would make me stay, but the reason that made my decision-making so hard is the people. Some of the guys who I’ve invested in, some of them will stay here to serve the church here. Some of my closest friends will be here. My groomsmen, half of them will still be here. The youth group, I’ll miss. I had hopes of seeing Zach go through high school with the other youth kids. You know the relationships I’ve developed here… that’ll be the biggest thing. The reason I stayed here is the church, so inevitably, the thing I’ll miss the most is the church.

What would you like to see happening at LBCSJ in the coming years?

As general as it sounds, I want to see Christ exalted in the church. I don’t want the church to be about ourselves and this man-centered agenda. I really want to see Christ glorified in everything. I want to see all the members on board with that. To let go of our selfishness and pride, and see God glorified. I want to see everyone ultra-passionate in pursuing that, and not be satisfied with being complacent. It’s hard for me to say what I want to see in terms of practical goals for the church plant because that’s hard. Fruit is the Lord’s work. What I want is our team to be faithful to God’s calling. But do I want to see the congregation to grow to be 100 or something? I don’t know. That’s not the measure of success to me. The measure of success is how faithful we are. I’d like to see the team to be humble before each other and learn to work together. I want to see the younger guys step up into leadership, and some of the older guys to help lead them. I would like to see the San Jose community be impacted whether it be through us or the other churches there. I love Lighthouse and I love what it did to me personally because the teaching that Pastor John, Pat, and the elders provided really changed me and helped me struggle through college. And I know there are others in San Jose who don’t have the resources and I would love to help provide that.

Let’s say you stepped into the building of LBCSD on one Sunday morning ten years from now (should the Lord tarry), what would you like to see?

I would like to see Tim Yu have at least 2 kids and hopefully one of them is a boy and so if we have a boy, we can have them play together. I want to see Eugene Park married. I’d like to see Pat just doing his thing as Senior Pastor. I’m excited to see how that’ll turn out. I’m nervous for him as I watch him struggle through some things right now. I’m excited to see what God’s going to do. I guess Cameron Preslar would be in youth group, so I would want to see what they look like. Hopefully I see more brown people come out. I would like to see the youth group grow… that’s like my baby. I want to see whoever’s taking over the ministry to step it up and have the ministry flourish in the Lord.

How can we as a congregation encourage you and Kathy in the upcoming year?

Be praying for us. For both of us to be individually grow and stay close to the Lord individually. When that’s set, together we’ll be a strong couple. And together we’ll be an effective team for the church plant. Pray for us to work together as a family. Pray for my schooling. I would like to end at the end of 2010 just to make things less complicated. So I can also open myself up for the church plant as much as I love seminary. Pray for the team, that’s been on my heart as well.

Any last words?

I love Lighthouse Bible Church San Diego. I really do. I hope you realize that it was a very hard decision to make. I fasted for ten days! And I’m already thin! Youth kids, I hope you realize how much I love you, and it kills me to be apart from you. But I know this is what the Lord’s calling me to do, to plant churches. I’m going to miss you guys a lot, a lot, a lot. And I’ll be praying for you. And the church body: Know that my prayers will always be with you. You can always e-mail me if you want prayer support. I’ll forever be thankful for the guys who have invested in me, and I mean…I know who’s going up, but the ones who are staying… Pat, I want Pat to know that he would have been the main reason for me to stay because he invested so much in me. Be praying for him a lot. I don’t want him to think I’m ditching him.. and for guys like Peter, Mike, and Tim Yu, and Ted who will be here. All those who have invested in me either as mentors or as brothers. I don’t give up on my friends easily. And all the ones I’ve invested in. You’re not off the hook, man. If I come here in ten years and you’re not in shape, I’ll take you up to San Jose with me, and lock you up in my basement. Hahaha.. I’m just kidding. I’m in prayer for you guys too. I discipled you guys in light of what could happen (the church plant). The whole purpose was to get you guys equipped for ministry to grow in your character to be available and to really mobilize for God. Just be available to do that, and let God do amazing things through you guys. To God be the glory!

to be continued next week with Pastor John…

by Richard Shin

Since the announcement of the San Jose church plant in January 2009, there has been a deluge of questions raised towards the pastoral staff. The “Why” questions (“Why San Jose?”, “Why now?”, “Why you, Pastor John?”) have been beaten to death, and the questions asked here attempt to answer none of that. But as part of bringing 1 Timothy 5:17 and Hebrews 13:17 to life, here we make an attempt to understand and hopefully serve our pastors a little better.

I had the privilege of interviewing the three pastors regarding the church plant, and the ensuing transitions that are happening this year. But more than the factual details, I wanted to know how they felt and what they thought; I wanted to make this a little more personal. What you see is essentially verbatim how the interviews went, and the arrangement in order is simply chronological. You will see some overlap in questions, but the answers I got were very different, yet all aimed towards the glory of God and enjoyment of Him. It is my sincere hope that this would stir you to really understand and love our pastors.

The first one was with Pastor JR. As we met over some Flame Broiler meat bowls, we were able to talk about a variety of topics. As he shares his experience and his thoughts, the youth group (his “baby”, he calls it) and the future, you will get to see and understand different shades of JR you might not have known before. You’ll see his passion, his hopes, his fears, his love, and much more, all working intimately together for the glory of God. And still, I imagine this interview barely scratches the surface of who JR Cuevas is. Yet, I hope you are encouraged and stirred reading the interview as much as I was conducting it.

What will your role be at LBCSJ? What activities specifically (what books, seminary classes, Bible studies, etc.) are helping you towards fulfilling that role?

Well right now I’m on the administrative team (the A-Team) which is kind of like the leadership team. And everybody has their own role. I’m in the leadership team so I provide the overall structure under Pastor John. In seminary, I took a seminary class on church planting anticipating around this time, there would be a church plant. I mean everything I learned, I will put to use any way. I’m going to read some books on missions. The basic thing is getting my feet wet. There’s only so much you can do with reading books and stuff.

Pastor John was thinking about having me help out with the youth and children again. So one thing he had me do was two months ago he had me take over LKC because he wanted me to gain some experience. When any church starts, they’ll typically need a children’s ministry. That’s when the young families will come. The youth can sit with their parents. In terms of the youth, there’s Pastor John’s family. So, we’ll have at least two youth and one child. We’ll see what happens with Kathy and me. And then there’s Peter and Joyce. And you know… who knows?

More generally speaking, what have you been doing, or will be doing, to help you prepare yourself emotionally, physically, and spiritually for the church plant?

Spiritually, it’s a lot of prayer. I’ve been praying a long time for this. It’s not something I can say I’m spiritually ready for. I don’t have the mentality that says “I’m going to be great!” It’s not like I’m pessimistic, but I think I’m a little more sober. If anything, I’m pessimistic about my own abilities because every time I try to do something for the Lord, there has always been some resistance and a lot of trials involved. So I’m anticipating that. Spiritually, I’m just trying to stay close to God and make sure I’m walking intimately with Him. So quiet times and prayer, those things are key. I’m trying to encourage myself that it’s not what I’m capable of doing, but what He’s capable of doing through me.

And emotionally, I’m not trying to detach myself from San Diego, but really trying to keep my eyes on San Jose because it’s easy to become attached to the ministries here; it makes it harder to leave. I’m just trying to be mindful of San Jose.

Physically, I’m trying to get into shape. I used to work as a trainer a couple years ago so I’m kind of familiar with that. I’m setting a New Year resolution to do a triathlon in February and possibly a marathon in May. Because I figured, especially in the beginning, there’s going to be a lot of lifting. And I have a pretty weak upper body so I need to build up my strength. So I’m doing a lot of pushups and a lot of pull-ups and getting a lot of endurance so I don’t fall apart when I’m up there. Making sure the body’s in top condition. That’s what I got from Jim Elliot too. When he was a student, he took care of his body so he could minister. But the spiritual aspects, that’s the most important thing.

Are you scared?

Satan likes to attack strong leaders and strong families. Not that I’m afraid of him, but anticipating the struggles and the resistances. It’s going to be hard and demanding; I’ll probably lose a lot of sleep. It’s going to be hard on the family. It’s hard when there’s so much time being taken away, and you can’t have date nights every night. If anything it’ll be the opposite. So I’m anticipating a lot of struggles for Kathy and the strain that’s going to be put on her and the strain on me. There’s going to a lot of criticism from other people and the trials that are going to come because it’s not always a clean thing and when you try to do things right in pastoral ministry. People who are on board will be with you and those who are half hearted, they’ll criticize you. Even from well-meaning Christians. I’ve never planted a church but I know as long as I follow Christ, persecutions will come. When I went into ministry, I thought the same thing, that trials would come… and they did! So I’m anticipating that. Conflict in the team, that’s going to happen. That’s always stressful. I’m not hopeless; I’m just preparing myself for those things.

What has been a significant concern/challenge so far? Significant blessing (if different)?

There hasn’t been a lot practical development right now. So getting the team mobilized. Getting everyone passionate and getting the teams to develop good relationships. Scheduling has been difficult. When you’re in the A-Team, you have to take into consideration that others might not, and a lot of these things are beyond me. The scope and wisdom. So I’m learning a lot on the spot. So that’s been hard for me because practically it’s hard for me; I’ve never been an elder or anything that this position is called to do. Emotionally and spiritually it’s hard as I’m trying to trust God understanding the ramifications of a lot of these things like what they are and how to deal with them. So that’s been hard.

Significant blessing is just being with the team, just getting to know them. I have Kevin Chan in my accountability group so just getting to know him has been good. The A-Team guys, developing relationships with them. In the practical sense, nothing has happened, but just getting to know everyone has been a tremendous blessing. I’ve always been excited about church planting in spite of the many struggles that come with it. It’s something I always wanted to do. Even in my seminary application, I wrote I wanted to help Lighthouse carry out its vision. And the fact that I get to be part of it regardless of my role is really exciting and a huge blessing. And the fact that Kathy and I can be a part of it together, and the fact that we can work together. She’s been really supportive too. So that’s been good.

to be continued…